Just like to say thanks

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SteveV
First Lieutenant
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 9:50 pm

Just like to say thanks

Unread postby SteveV » Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:04 pm

For creating such a great game and getting the balance between hardcore simulation and just plain fun exactly right. I have just been playing the demo and been blown away, I was kind of put off by the cartoony unit symbols in all the screenshots but like they say you should never judge a book by its cover.

Before I purchase UOC and the Red Turn DLC can I confirm that I will need to add the 1.04 upgrade to UOC BEFORE installing Red Turn or do I install both and then add the upgrade?

Also, a couple of gameplay questions -

1.When would I ever want to blow up a bridge? I could understand in a defensive position that denying the use of a bridge could be important but as you are always the attacker in games against the AI surely you need the bridges to facilitate movement?

2. Partisans - they don't actually appear as units on the map, just the hex that they occupy - is that correct? I was watching a You Tube gameplay video and the guy said 'I hate partisans' but then appeared to ignore them entirely for the scenario with no ill effects. Do you just occupy the hex they control to get rid of them?

Shatner
First Lieutenant
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:53 pm

Re: Just like to say thanks

Unread postby Shatner » Mon Jan 21, 2013 11:29 pm

SteveV wrote:1.When would I ever want to blow up a bridge? I could understand in a defensive position that denying the use of a bridge could be important but as you are always the attacker in games against the AI surely you need the bridges to facilitate movement?

2. Partisans - they don't actually appear as units on the map, just the hex that they occupy - is that correct? I was watching a You Tube gameplay video and the guy said 'I hate partisans' but then appeared to ignore them entirely for the scenario with no ill effects. Do you just occupy the hex they control to get rid of them?

1. I've never had cause to do this. As you say, if there is ever a scenario where you are on the defensive, or at least have a very vulnerable flank you need to forestall an attack on, then it could be useful, but otherwise isn't really needed.

2. Partisans are soviet non-combatants making life hard on the conquering Germans. All they do is cause hexes that aren't 1) in a city, 2) containing a railroad, and 3) within the ZoC of an enemy unit to switch from German to Soviet control. Note that weakened units (units that have fewer than 3 active steps) don't exert a ZoC, so partisans can be used adjacent to them. Anyway, partisans are used for three things:
A) To strain or cut-off supplies to the enemy. German supplies can't travel through Soviet-controlled hexes so your partisans can make it so a swath of German troops don't get their supply of ammunition and fuel on time. Note that while you can't directly capture a railroad with partisans, if you capture 4 of the 6 hexes surrounding a railroad, and all 4 of those hexes are on the same side of a river, then that railroad hex will switch to Soviet control. Doing this can cause severe supply issues for the Germans, and is a nice tool to have access to in a few scenarios.
B) Expand the ZoC of a Soviet unit. Say you break through a German line and want to cut off the retreat of the encircled enemy troops. The unit of yours that is blocking the Germans is unlikely to be surrounded by Soviet-owned hexes, and their ZoC only extends to adjacent controlled hexes. By using partisans to extend your unit's ZoC you can ensnare a couple more enemy troops when they try to fall-back.
C) Extend Soviet supplies. Sometimes your supplies would reach a bit further if one or two more hexes in your backfield were swapped (maybe because you just finished killing off an enemy trying to sever your supply-chain). Having the partisans revert those hexes to Soviet control can spare an actual fighting unit the hassle.

SteveV
First Lieutenant
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 9:50 pm

Re: Just like to say thanks

Unread postby SteveV » Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:54 am

Thanks Shatner, this really is a great game for when you have an hour to spare and want to try out an idea in a scenario. It takes that long to set up one turn in Decisive Campaigns: Case Blue! Still trying to get my head around the supply logic but other than that the mechanics are really elegant.

I don't know why some people complain that the game is too hard (I read through most of the posts in the forum before getting the game), it may be hard to get a perfect score but just to win the scenarios (as the Axis anyway) is not THAT difficult. Making sure you have enough movement points (and space) to pull units back from the line after attacking and replace them with fresh ones seems to be a fairly straightforward tactic that works for me. Its kind of like chess in that you want to visualise the best position to leave your forces in before the opponents next turn and not leave the AI with a good 'move'..

Stahlgewitter
Captain
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 4:22 pm

Re: Just like to say thanks

Unread postby Stahlgewitter » Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:28 am

I have blown exactly 2 bridges:

- The northermost one in 2nd Kharkov so the German infantry there could be withdrawn without the Soviets capturing Belgorod
- One in Terek, constructed by me in the centre of the map to allow the forces there to cross the river, because the Red cavalry unit was sniffing around and could potentially have cut my supplies

It's not a very useful option for sure - never even considered using it in Red Turn thus far.

jcgator
First Lieutenant
Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:33 pm

Re: Just like to say thanks

Unread postby jcgator » Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:09 pm

My opinion on blowing bridges in "Red Turn" is that it would rarely be a necessity as the Soviets were making fairly rapid process towards Germany and there would be little need to cover your rear as the Germans were retreating steadily and unlikely to penetrate your lines with a counter-offensive. Although with my mediocre generalship, I sometimes wish I had blown a bridge when the Panzers cut through a breach in my line! Bridge blowing might come in more handy in the Stalingrad campaign when the outcome was still in doubt with both sides on the move at different junctures and the front lines more fluid.

My question is this: does the AI ever blow bridges? I've yet to see it and there are a couple scenarios in which a blown bridge on defense would really slow my advance. Really like the AI overall - gives me a good test on offense and defense.

SteveV
First Lieutenant
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 9:50 pm

Re: Just like to say thanks

Unread postby SteveV » Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:24 pm

Yep, excellent game and my initial question about the 1.04 update is moot because thats the version you download!


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